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Friday, July 03, 2009

Re: [AlpacaTalk] CDT shots for late term girls



Hi Wendy;

 

We personally give them the CDT right after they have their crias. We have talked to some of the vets in OR as well as our local vets who have been in the llamas and alpacas 30+ years, and they don't reccomend it until after birth or a couple weeks before you start breeding for the next cria. According to our vet, CDT after the birth of the cria also allows them to transfer it while nursing but doesn't fully cover the cria. We know of a farm down in OR who we have known for many years. They had given their pregnant girls the CDT and sure enough, they all aborted. We have never had the abortion issues due to the fact that we have never given CDT while they were pregnant but it seems to be prevelant in the responses already posted.

Hopefully your vet can help you...

 

Maegan Blessing

Cedar Grove Alpacas, LLC.



----- Original Message -----
From: "wnunezcruz" <wnunezcruz@aol.com>
To: AlpacaTalk@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, July 3, 2009 4:37:35 PM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific
Subject: [AlpacaTalk] CDT shots for late term girls



I have 3 girls that are due in 4 to 8 weeks. I just got them so I was wondering if I should go ahead had give them their CDT shots or wait until after the births?

Thanks,

Wendy

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RE: [AlpacaTalk] CDT shots for late term girls



 
I've always given CDT shots 1 month prior to delivery and never had a problem. None of my animals seem to get very stressed with shots. I just herd them into a small space so I don't have to chase them down. For the boys I have an 8x8 pen outside with grass they seem to love. I open the gate and they all run in. I call it the candy store. The small space make things so easy. They can't run and you don't have to restrain them. Flossie

Flossie and Joe Carmichael
GentleGrangeAlpacas
Jamison,Pa.
Home-215-918-0339
Cell-267-614-9620
http://www.alpacanation.com/gentlegrange.asp




 


To: AlpacaTalk@yahoogroups.com
From: wnunezcruz@aol.com
Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 23:37:35 +0000
Subject: [AlpacaTalk] CDT shots for late term girls



I have 3 girls that are due in 4 to 8 weeks. I just got them so I was wondering if I should go ahead had give them their CDT shots or wait until after the births?

Thanks,

Wendy




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Re: [AlpacaTalk] CDT shots for late term girls



My girl was only 3 months when she received her cdt shot because of an infection on the bottom of her foot, & she aborted a few days later.  We took the chance as she was in the begining of her pregnancy and bred her in the spring.  Now, we only give that shot when females are open.
 
Shirley Dillon
 
Alpacas of Gemini Farm
Basking Ridge, NJ  07920
 
 

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Re: [AlpacaTalk] CDT shots for late term girls




Hello Wendy,

First and foremost, I'd suggest working with your vet.  My experience:  We gave CDT to 15 female alpacas at this stage of pregnancy many years ago and a couple days later, most of them aborted.  My vet said it could have been the CDT, could have been a "bad batch" of CDT or perhaps just the stress of catching them up and giving them the shots.  He couldn't say but since then, we haven't given CDT to pregnant females and wait until after they deliver.  I'm not a vet but this was my experience and I can't even say for certain if that was the cause....but as for me, we don't risk it at our farm.  Hopefully others will share their experiences as well.

Libby

Libby Forstner
Magical Farms, Inc.
Litchfield Ohio
(330)667-3233



"shirley" <shirl.temple2@verizon.net>
Sent by: AlpacaTalk@yahoogroups.com

07/03/2009 07:47 PM

Please respond to
AlpacaTalk@yahoogroups.com

To
<AlpacaTalk@yahoogroups.com>
cc
Subject
Re: [AlpacaTalk] CDT shots for late term girls







Hi Wendy,

I would wait if they were my girls. The only time I would give that shot to
pregnant girls would be if there was a problem, like a foot infection,
mainly for the tetnus.
As it has been known to cause abortion.

Shirley Dillon

Alpacas of Gemini Farm
Basking Ridge, NJ 07920

www.alpacanation.com/geminifarm.asp
908-647-2995
----- Original Message -----
From: "wnunezcruz" <
wnunezcruz@aol.com>
To: <
AlpacaTalk@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, July 03, 2009 7:37 PM
Subject: [AlpacaTalk] CDT shots for late term girls

>I have 3 girls that are due in 4 to 8 weeks. I just got them so I was
>wondering if I should go ahead had give them their CDT shots or wait until
>after the births?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Wendy
>
>


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Re: [AlpacaTalk] CDT shots for late term girls



That is the recommended time to do CD&T boosters, so if you plan to, now is the time! 


We don't feed grain, so don't do CD&T shots any more. According to Eric Hoffman and Dr. E Murray Fowler, alpacas do not get C. perfingens type C or D. A tetanus vaccine is available from your vet or online livestock products retailers such as Valley Vet or Jeffers LIvestock. I understand that a C perfingens type A vaccine is now available, and alpacas do suffer from that in South America. It is rarely seen in North America, from what I've read.

Here's an old post of mine regarding CD&T, with a few minor edits.


From The Alpaca Book by Eric Hoffman and E. Murray Fowler, DVM:

Pages 212-213
Five types of Clostridium perfringens are known to affect animals. ... Alpacas are known to be susceptible to types A, C, and D. ... Type A enterotoxemia will be emphasized because it is a serious problem in South America and there is evidence that it has also occurred in North America.
...

Prevention
... Vaccination for Type C & D is commonly available in North America, but, in the case of the alpaca, there is no confirmation that protection has been obtained. No suitable vaccine against Type A toxin is available.

Type A enterotoxemia
Type A enterotoxemia is the most serious disease of neonate alpacas in Peru. ...   (***See above!)

Type C enterotoxemia
...
Experience with Type C enterotoxin in North American alpacas and llamas is of a different nature. No outbreaks have been reported; rather sporadic cases here and there. Infection is usually observed in the neonate of less than two weeks of age that is nursing a mother with high milk production.

Type D enterotoxemia
Type D enterotoxemia (overeating disease) has not been diagnosed in alpacas in Peru, and only sporadic cases have been reported in North America. Type D enterotoxemia is a serious disease of feedlot cattle and sheep, or in animals on lush pastures, or those being overfed with grains.

Vaccinations Commonly Used in Camelids
CD/T
Clostridium perfringens type C, D, and C. tetani 
A commonly used vaccine. C. perfringens has been implicated in diarrhea and sudden deaths in crias and occasionally adults. All animals are at risk for tetanus following infection primarily through wounds, castrations, etc.
One common vaccination schedule is vaccination of adults yearly; pregnant females 4-6 weeks prior to parturition; crias at 3-4 months old and again 4 weeks later then yearly thereafter.1 Other protocols are also used and can be tailored to suit individual farm situations.

This is new info since I last visited their site:
Clostridium perfringens Type A Toxoid
Recently developed vaccine for use in cattle.
Evaluated at WSU VTH on alpacas
1. No vaccine site reactions were seen.
 2. This product was NOT evaluated on pregnant animals.
 3. Titers were measured and results indicated an immune response occurred but the degree of protection provided is unknown at this time.


A very influential breeder in Northern California says she does not give CD&T vaccines, last time I saw her respond to the CD&T question on a discussion group, probably for the reasons given above. I, for one, respect her wisdom, and since we don't feed grain, we have a very low risk of enterotoxemia. 


If you're mainly concerned about tetanus, which we all should be, it is available as a single vaccine through your vet or some online mail-order retailers:

And they also sell rabies vaccine:
I don't know if your state requires livestock to be vaccinated for rabies by a vet, but if not, this is the place to get your vaccine!


By the way, Botulism protection IS NOT obtained through CD&T vaccine. How many times do I have to go through this? Botulism is Clostridium Botulinum, NOT Clostridium perfringens type anything, or even Clostridium tetani. Totally different strain of Clostridium altogether. Wikipedia gives a very nice tutorial on them all, look it up. There is no vaccine for Botulism. It is treated after diagnosis.

NO protection to botulism is given through CD&T vaccines. There is no vaccine for Botulism. The C in CD&T is for clostridium perfringens type C. Type C. The D is for clostridium perfringens type D. The T is for clostridium tetani. That's it, and that all it will ever be. The C is not for all types of clostridium. 




Heather



On Jul 3, 2009, at 4:37 PM, wnunezcruz wrote:



I have 3 girls that are due in 4 to 8 weeks. I just got them so I was wondering if I should go ahead had give them their CDT shots or wait until after the births?

Thanks,

Wendy

__._,_.___
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Re: [AlpacaTalk] CDT shots for late term girls



Hi Wendy,

I would wait if they were my girls. The only time I would give that shot to
pregnant girls would be if there was a problem, like a foot infection,
mainly for the tetnus.
As it has been known to cause abortion.

Shirley Dillon

Alpacas of Gemini Farm
Basking Ridge, NJ 07920

www.alpacanation.com/geminifarm.asp
908-647-2995
----- Original Message -----
From: "wnunezcruz" <wnunezcruz@aol.com>
To: <AlpacaTalk@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, July 03, 2009 7:37 PM
Subject: [AlpacaTalk] CDT shots for late term girls

>I have 3 girls that are due in 4 to 8 weeks. I just got them so I was
>wondering if I should go ahead had give them their CDT shots or wait until
>after the births?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Wendy
>
>

__._,_.___
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[AlpacaTalk] CDT shots for late term girls



I have 3 girls that are due in 4 to 8 weeks. I just got them so I was wondering if I should go ahead had give them their CDT shots or wait until after the births?

Thanks,

Wendy

__._,_.___
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[AlpacaTalk] Friday ad - Introduction to Suri Breed-Up Program



If you have entry-level suri females that you want to improve upon, bring them to LadySong! LadySong's lineup of high quality, genetically-rich (including Accoyos), ribbon- and banner-winning suri machos are guaranteed to produce crias that are an improvement on your dam, or the next breeding is absolutely free! Our males carry genetics from the finest names in the suri alpaca industry: Inca, Sedoso, Ramillo, Baron, Accoyo Montoyo, Harry Brown, Sheriff, Sergeant Major Jax, and Principe Platino to name a few.  Whether you're looking for white, true black, fawn or pattern, our breeding males have all won -- at minimum -- a blue ribbon; three have multiple championships! Whether you're looking for improvement in color, lock style, luster, density, or conformation, we can help you meet your goals.  Call today to reserve a breeding to your choice of our excellent males.

 

We aren't afraid to help you kick up the quality of your herd! We feel the true test of a macho is not what he produces from a "high end dam," but what he can bring to an unimproved female.  Our males are here to serve you, and we guarantee they'll advance your breeding goals or your next breeding is absolutely free!

 

Visit our herdsire lineup at www.alpacanation.com/ladysong.asp.  Then call (716) 499-0383 to discuss your needs, and start to put your suri breeding program on track for the quality you want!


 Judith Korff
LadySong Farm
Music to Your Wallet
Randolph, New York 14772 
Cell: (716) 499-0383
 

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[AlpacaTalk] True Black proven dam - Color Champion!



Hi everyone! I hope everyone has a happy and festive (and safe!) Independence Day!


Today I have a wonderful girl to tell you about. Cherokee Hills Shelby. She has 2 blue ribbons at composite shows, and one Color Champ, and another blue ribbon for her fleece. 

Here grandsire is the famous SA Trinidad, who was a great influence on black breeding programs around the country. He was a Champion Maker!

Shelby is on sale for $9,000. Her owner has two daughters and needs to diversify her bloodlines. Shelby is currently bred to my wonderful dark maroon herdsire, Sienna Illusion, son of Silver Creek and grandson of Peruvian Pluro. Sienna has one black cria from a maroon dam and one maroon cria from a rose grey dam, so far. More are on the way!

To discuss Shelby, feel free to contact me or her owner, Toni Kester of Spirit Eagle Alpacas. yarnpeddler@hotmail.com

Thanks! 
Heather

Heather Zeleny
White Lotus Alpacas
Oregon

Holistic Farm and Elite Fleece

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