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Monday, January 26, 2009

Re: [AlpacaTalk] neonatal book on Ebay


I'm not advertising this nor do I know who is, I just saw this and it is
just such a great book I've used many, many times and a really good deal for
someone.

_http://cgi.ebay.com/Llama-and-Alpaca-Neonatal-Care_W0QQitemZ130283994399QQihZ
003QQcategoryZ53059QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem_
(http://cgi.ebay.com/Llama-and-Alpaca-Neonatal-Care_W0QQitemZ130283994399QQihZ003QQcategoryZ53059Q
QssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem)

SUSAN OLSON
Alpaca Loco
Riverside, CA

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Re: [AlpacaTalk] Bone Tumor: Update

Wow Jim. I'm so sorry.

We have a girl who had a bone abcess in her jaw. treating her with
antibiotics did clear it up and now there's only a very small lump
compared to the golf ball there used to be.

I heard of someone once who had a girl with a similar story to yours.
It did turn out to be a deep abcess also, and I don't recall the
outcome. And I don't recall who it was, either.

Sorry I wasn't any help at all. I hope you find a good course of
treatment for her!

Best wishes,
Heather

On Jan 26, 2009, at 7:27 PM, J Guerin wrote:

> Hi again all,
>
> Just talked again with the vet. The suspected tumor is in the
> humerus bone. I asked her if the xrays could be sent to someone
> else for a second opinion, like WSU, and she said she would be
> happy to do that. Also, she asked if I could bring Brandie in to
> have digital pics taken, which I will do next week.
>
> Thanks for your thoughts.
>
> Jim Guerin
> Jimmini Farm
> Yelm, WA
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: J Guerin
> To: AlpacaTalk@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Monday, January 26, 2009 5:34 PM
> Subject: [AlpacaTalk] Bone Tumor
>
>
> Hi all,
>
> For several months later last year, I noticed my Lil bottle baby
> girl, Brandie, was favoring her front right leg. When Brandie would
> turn say to the left, she would sort of drag her right leg around,
> not putting much weight on it. Some times she would stumble when
> she was walking. I had a suspicion something might be wrong shortly
> after she was born, but this didnt show its self fully untill she
> was about nine months old, Started out with off and on limping.
>
> I had the vet out the end of Dec 08. After paplating from her foot
> up, when Amy got to her shoulder ( I believe it is actually in her
> elbow, but not sure ) Amy was way up past what I would call the
> elbow, but from the skeleton pic in the Big Book, not sure if an
> xray could be taken there, Brandie let me know that that HURT. She
> turned her head and looked me right in the eye.
>
> Today, I finally got a call back from the vet, Amy. She had been
> waiting on OSU to read the xrays. From what they can figure out,
> compairing to other species, it looks like Brandie has a bone
> tumor. She was one year old on 20 Nov 08.
>
> OSU suggested a bone biopsy. Amy suggested waiting and taking
> another set of xrays in a month.
>
> Any thoughts?
>
> Thanks.
>
> Jim Guerin
> Jimmini Farm
> Yelm, WA
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: [AlpacaTalk] Bone Tumor: Update

Hi again all,

Just talked again with the vet. The suspected tumor is in the humerus bone. I asked her if the xrays could be sent to someone else for a second opinion, like WSU, and she said she would be happy to do that. Also, she asked if I could bring Brandie in to have digital pics taken, which I will do next week.

Thanks for your thoughts.

Jim Guerin
Jimmini Farm
Yelm, WA

----- Original Message -----
From: J Guerin
To: AlpacaTalk@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, January 26, 2009 5:34 PM
Subject: [AlpacaTalk] Bone Tumor


Hi all,

For several months later last year, I noticed my Lil bottle baby girl, Brandie, was favoring her front right leg. When Brandie would turn say to the left, she would sort of drag her right leg around, not putting much weight on it. Some times she would stumble when she was walking. I had a suspicion something might be wrong shortly after she was born, but this didnt show its self fully untill she was about nine months old, Started out with off and on limping.

I had the vet out the end of Dec 08. After paplating from her foot up, when Amy got to her shoulder ( I believe it is actually in her elbow, but not sure ) Amy was way up past what I would call the elbow, but from the skeleton pic in the Big Book, not sure if an xray could be taken there, Brandie let me know that that HURT. She turned her head and looked me right in the eye.

Today, I finally got a call back from the vet, Amy. She had been waiting on OSU to read the xrays. From what they can figure out, compairing to other species, it looks like Brandie has a bone tumor. She was one year old on 20 Nov 08.

OSU suggested a bone biopsy. Amy suggested waiting and taking another set of xrays in a month.

Any thoughts?

Thanks.

Jim Guerin
Jimmini Farm
Yelm, WA

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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[AlpacaTalk] Bone Tumor

Hi all,

For several months later last year, I noticed my Lil bottle baby girl, Brandie, was favoring her front right leg. When Brandie would turn say to the left, she would sort of drag her right leg around, not putting much weight on it. Some times she would stumble when she was walking. I had a suspicion something might be wrong shortly after she was born, but this didnt show its self fully untill she was about nine months old, Started out with off and on limping.

I had the vet out the end of Dec 08. After paplating from her foot up, when Amy got to her shoulder ( I believe it is actually in her elbow, but not sure ) Amy was way up past what I would call the elbow, but from the skeleton pic in the Big Book, not sure if an xray could be taken there, Brandie let me know that that HURT. She turned her head and looked me right in the eye.

Today, I finally got a call back from the vet, Amy. She had been waiting on OSU to read the xrays. From what they can figure out, compairing to other species, it looks like Brandie has a bone tumor. She was one year old on 20 Nov 08.

OSU suggested a bone biopsy. Amy suggested waiting and taking another set of xrays in a month.

Any thoughts?

Thanks.

Jim Guerin
Jimmini Farm
Yelm, WA

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: [AlpacaTalk] Girls or boys?

"3 or 4 fiber boys (I also feel 2 is not enough, they are herd
animals and need greater numbers to feel safe) is a lot more
affordable than 3 or 4 young breedable maidens."

I've definitely been rethinking my idea that I'd start with 2 -- that was
just a minimum knowing that they needed more than one, but I'm learning now
that they do a lot better with 3 or 4 in the group, so I'll be looking now
at an absolute minimum purchase at the start of three, but hopefully going
to four.

- Caryn

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Re: [AlpacaTalk] Girls or boys?

Those are interesting points, but I have some differing views.

I disagree with selling of crias. We recently had a horrible
experience with that. The weanling, not cria, was transported to its
new home across the country, arrived injured, and was suddenly
severely cow-hocked. The buyer didn't inform us of this until after
shearing, some months later. She ranted and raved, said a lot of
horrible things, and possibly even called some names. She then
forwarded pics of our boy, who was, and hopefully still is, the
sweetest little thing... They had shorn off his topknot and his tail
down to the skin. Then she continued her tirade about his cowhocks
and how she had planned to show him (purchased for $500, sight unseen
except pics). We still wonder about his treatment, since they
butchered his topknot and tail at shearing. Who would to that to an
animal they love? And did she really plan to show him at halter with
a shear job like that? It just makes my heart sick. We offered to buy
him back and pay for his return transport. She refused. So I won't
sell any of my alpacas until they are at least one year old.

Crias and weanlings are still babies. Alpacas are herd animals and
need the comfort of the group they were born with, until they're over
1 year old, at least.

We and everyone we knew, used to breed females at 1 year. Today it is
normal to begin breeding at 15-24 months.

Even young maidens, if breedable, will cost easily 5-10 times what a
fiber or pet boy will cost. To get started and still not sure if she
wants to get into breeding at all, it seems like an expensive option
if she decides she doesn't want to breed alpacas.

The entire breeding discussion is quite involved. Whether to buy
breedings ($1K+ each, up to $10K!) or to buy your own sires. I have
picked up sires at nearly pet boy prices, with really excellent
lineage, fleece, even show winnings including 1st places.

It really comes down to whether or not you want to breed, and whether
you want to invest in breeding/breedable females right away, or wait
and see.3 or 4 fiber boys (I also feel 2 is not enough, they are herd
animals and need greater numbers to feel safe) is a lot more
affordable than 3 or 4 young breedable maidens.

Just my opinions.
Heather

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Re: [AlpacaTalk] Girls or boys?

Hi Caryn:
In your place I would purchase 2 female crea of as good a quality as I
could afford.

Here's why:
1/They will produce the fleece you require as yearlings yet should cost
less than older, proven animals.

2/By the time they are ready to breed at 3 yrs. you will be ready to
start your breeding herd. You will be starting with a young herd that
will produce crea and fiber for many, many years.

3/When you are ready to start breeding you can purchase stud services.
This way you do not have to purchase any macho's until you have enough
hembras to keep a macho busy.

4/One of your females may give birth to a macho that is of breeding
quality and be able to use him on the unrelated hembra and trade stud
services for the other one. There may not be a high probability of this
happening but if your original two girls are of high enough quality and
the machos you breed them to are of excellent quality also it is a
definite possibility.

5/The final reason for buying now rather than later is that I do not see
the prices of good quality breeding females going down any time soon and
in fact anticipate an increase in price.

Showing is a non issue as far as I am concerned as either male or
female, young or old may be shown. Quality is the deciding factor when
it comes to showing.

By for now:
Wayne
http://bramblewoods.com/
http://wordsmith.fateback.com/
http://jubileeacres.net/

<-----Original Message----->
>From: Caryn Law [law.caryn@gmail.com]
>Sent: 1/26/2009 3:35:39 PM
>To: AlpacaTalk@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [AlpacaTalk] Girls or boys?
>
>Hello everyone!
>
>When I (hopefully) buy my first alpacas this year (probably two to
start
>with), I'm wondering...do I buy boys or girls?
>
>I don't plan to show alpacas. I'm interested in owning them purely for
the
>fiber as I'm a handspinner who would like to use their fiber for
handspun
>products. We aren't interested in getting into the breeding aspect of
>alpacas right away as we don't want to overextend ourselves and want to
get
>experienced with just owning them before breeding. But I know that if I
want
>to expand my herd, I'll either have to buy from someone else or have a
>breeding female. On the one hand, I like the idea of having a breedable
>female eventually (so I would want to start by owning females) for this
>purpose, but on the other hand breeding females are very, very pricey,
and
>I'm wondering as a fiber-only owner if I'll want to just stick with
buying
>my alpacas from someone else, in which case I suppose I could go with
either
>boys or girls.
>
>Any advice? As far as owning both, I'm not sure I want to do that --
our
>pasture is one large plot with two small divisions in it that total
three
>paddocks, but the paddocks aren't separated enough, I believe, to allow
for
>proper seperation of the sexes.
>
>Looking forward to hearing from the experts!
>
>Also, is there a particular time of year that's best for buying your
>alpacas?
>
>- Caryn Law
>Issaquah, WA
>
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Re: [AlpacaTalk] Girls or boys?

Caryn; Just my opinion; but you might be careful when searching for a fiber animal vs a pet quality animal.  If you are looking for the fiber aspect of an alpaca you will want to be sure to get one with GOOD fiber production.  There are alpacas out there that are not going to produce high quality fiber.  My personal observation is that you might spend between $100-500 for a pet quality alpaca but it will take $400-1,000+ to buy a TRUE FIBER animal.  Others can correct me, but I think we are coming to a time when we need to start qualifying these animals as breeders vs fiber vs pet.
Have fun in your search.  Now or later in the Fall is a good time to buy. Springtime is cria season so alot of people are trying to make room now for their crias to come.  Fall is also a good time because people are thinking of feed expense for the winter months. The market is down so you have picked a good time to get into the business and starting with a few fiber boys would be a great idea. Be sure to see, touch and observe the animal before you buy.  Get your hands on more than one "fiber" animal and you will get a feel of what you want as a spinner and fiber artist.
You will enjoy these wonderful animals-boys-girls-breeders or non.  They are a real delight to own, especially when you can appreciate their fiber from a spinner's viewpoint.
Robin B

Ace & Robin Buettenback
B4 Alpacas LLC
3742 S Locust
Grand Island Ne 68801

--- On Mon, 1/26/09, Caryn Law <law.caryn@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Caryn Law <law.caryn@gmail.com>
Subject: [AlpacaTalk] Girls or boys?
To: AlpacaTalk@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, January 26, 2009, 2:34 PM

Hello everyone!

When I (hopefully) buy my first alpacas this year (probably two to start
with), I'm wondering... do I buy boys or girls?

I don't plan to show alpacas. I'm interested in owning them purely for the
fiber as I'm a handspinner who would like to use their fiber for handspun
products. We aren't interested in getting into the breeding aspect of
alpacas right away as we don't want to overextend ourselves and want to get
experienced with just owning them before breeding. But I know that if I want
to expand my herd, I'll either have to buy from someone else or have a
breeding female. On the one hand, I like the idea of having a breedable
female eventually (so I would want to start by owning females) for this
purpose, but on the other hand breeding females are very, very pricey, and
I'm wondering as a fiber-only owner if I'll want to just stick with buying
my alpacas from someone else, in which case I suppose I could go with either
boys or girls.

Any advice? As far as owning both, I'm not sure I want to do that -- our
pasture is one large plot with two small divisions in it that total three
paddocks, but the paddocks aren't separated enough, I believe, to allow for
proper seperation of the sexes.

Looking forward to hearing from the experts!

Also, is there a particular time of year that's best for buying your
alpacas?

- Caryn Law
Issaquah, WA

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: [AlpacaTalk] Girls or boys?

Caryn wrote: "Is there any particular first-visit etiquette I should know
about before I go? I can only imagine that it must be a little bit of an
imposition to show up at an alpaca farm "

Caryn,
I would call or e-mail them and express an interest in learning about their
farm and alpacas. Be flexible about scheduling your visit and the rest
should work out fine. Most alpaca people love having visitors and talking
about alpacas. I do not have any expectations when people come, however, I
have been surprised with a dessert (chocolate chip cookies, etc.) or a copy
of pictures that guest have taken and that is always appreciated.

Patty Mattingly
Nobella Alpacas
"Royal Treatment Reigns"
Leonardtown, MD
(240)925-6959
http://www.nobellaalpacas.com
>
> On Mon, Jan 26, 2009 at 2:00 PM, Caryn Law <law.caryn@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Thanks again, Heather! I'm glad to hear you mention those prices --
>> I've
>> been researching that and it's good to see that the prices I'm seeing are
>> in
>> fact realistic. I was so relieved to see those prices...when I first
>> started
>> researching all I saw were prices for breeding-quality animals and I just
>> about had a heart attack thinking that I'd never be able to afford
>> alpacas.
>>
>> While I have your ear, I wonder if you could weigh in on one more topic,
>> since you're always so informative and quick to respond? :) I'm planning
>> on
>> contacting some alpaca farms near me (there's actually a small one within
>> walking distance of my house) and asking if I can visit and talk to them
>> about the animals, see personally what's involved, etc.
>>
>> and expect them to suddenly teach me everything I need
>> to know about them, or ask to handle their animals at all, etc. I know a
>> lot
>> of farms are happy to talk to new people but I don't want to impose. At
>> the
>> same time, all sources are urging me to make personal visits (which of
>> course sounds reasonable).
>>
>> Thanks again for your valuable experience! :)
>>
>> - Caryn
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 26, 2009 at 12:49 PM, Heather Zeleny <
>> alpacatalk@westwindalpacas.com <alpacatalk%40westwindalpacas.com>> wrote:
>>
>> > I absolutely recommend getting a few fiber boys if you don't plan to
>> > show and don't want to breed, at least for now. They don't have to be
>> > gelded. I have heard of plenty of difficult to handle geldings so for
>> > alpacas it doesn't really make them more manageable. Fiber males can
>> > frequently be found for $250-1000. I personally would never pay more
>> > than $500 for a fiber male. Sometimes, people even give them away! We
>> > actually donated some fiber boys to some 4H people last year, and
>> > some of them had really nice, very fine fleece but weren't breeder
>> > quality.
>> >
>> > Girls will be more expensive. There are very few non-breeder girls
>> > out there, and they're usually priced much higher than fiber boys.
>> > And, they must be kept separate from males because even geldings will
>> > "breed." Very few non-breeder females have been spayed, so if she's a
>> > non-breeder due to issues that make pregnancy life-threatening or
>> > that she always loses them pre-term, she absolutely should not be
>> > kept with males, intact or not. And, as we've discussed before, a
>> > gelding will over breed her and cause sever uterine damage and
>> > infection is likely.
>> >
>> > I think starting with the fiber boys is a great way to get
>> > comfortable with them. If you later choose to have breeding females,
>> > you may be able to change fencelines to accommodate both, or you may
>> > just find new homes for your fiber boys.
>> >
>> > Heather
>> >
>> >
>> > On Jan 26, 2009, at 12:34 PM, Caryn Law wrote:
>> >
>> > > Hello everyone!
>> > >
>> > > When I (hopefully) buy my first alpacas this year (probably two to
>> > > start
>> > > with), I'm wondering...do I buy boys or girls?
>> > >
>> > > I don't plan to show alpacas. I'm interested in owning them purely
>> > > for the
>> > > fiber as I'm a handspinner who would like to use their fiber for
>> > > handspun
>> > > products. We aren't interested in getting into the breeding aspect of
>> > > alpacas right away as we don't want to overextend ourselves and
>> > > want to get
>> > > experienced with just owning them before breeding. But I know that
>> > > if I want
>> > > to expand my herd, I'll either have to buy from someone else or have
>> > > a
>> > > breeding female. On the one hand, I like the idea of having a
>> > > breedable
>> > > female eventually (so I would want to start by owning females) for
>> > > this
>> > > purpose, but on the other hand breeding females are very, very
>> > > pricey, and
>> > > I'm wondering as a fiber-only owner if I'll want to just stick with
>> > > buying
>> > > my alpacas from someone else, in which case I suppose I could go
>> > > with either
>> > > boys or girls.
>> > >
>> > > Any advice? As far as owning both, I'm not sure I want to do that
>> > > -- our
>> > > pasture is one large plot with two small divisions in it that total
>> > > three
>> > > paddocks, but the paddocks aren't separated enough, I believe, to
>> > > allow for
>> > > proper seperation of the sexes.
>> > >
>> > > Looking forward to hearing from the experts!
>> > >
>> > > Also, is there a particular time of year that's best for buying your
>> > > alpacas?
>> > >
>> > > - Caryn Law
>> > > Issaquah, WA
>> >
>> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
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> others with respect and civility.Yahoo! Groups Links
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