Re: [AlpacaTalk] not BEW
Hi Heather,
Wry mouth is not ignored by judges. It may be missed, but it is not ignored. I can assure you that none of the senior judges I have worked with... Jude, Amanda, Kristen, nor other judges Peter Kennedy or Tim Lavan would ever knowingly give a ribbon to an alpaca that they saw such a defect in. Having been in clinics with many of the other judges, I have no reason to imagine that they would "ignore" anything either.
As an industry, I think we are incredibly lucky to have the caliber of judges that we do. These are great folks where, whether everyone believes me or not, ribbons are awarded on merit, which from what I have heard in the horse and dog industry is often not the case, where you have to put in your dues before you even will be considered for a ribbon.
I have never seen one hint of a ribbon or banner being awarded inappropriately or dishonestly, in the last 4 years when I have been in the ring with the judges.
I would encourage you, if at all possible, to take pictures of this alpaca demonstrating the flaw, provide the show records (in general terms, so that there is some annonymity maintained if wanted), and send it off to the judges training committee and even to the senior judges so that all can learn from it. They are the first to admit that they are human and sometimes miss something, but they are also always willing to learn. All of the email addresses are on the AOBA Show site ( www.alpacashows.
It would be a great training tool, for they are putting together a training manual with illustrations and photos to assist training apprentices and keeping judges current as new things come up.
This would turn a negative situation (an alpaca being inappropriately awarded) to a positive. Perhaps our current methods need to be adjusted.
I can say without hesitation, every time I have been in the ring as a steward or as an apprentice (thousands of alpacas in the last 3 or 4 years), any time a bite has been off to one side or the other, further investigation has occured by the judge and a determination made.
I have great faith in all of our senior judges and the quality of the work they do sometimes under very trying circumstances.
Laurel
The Shouvlins
Bluebird Hills Farm
Springfield, Ohio
937-206-3936
www.bluebirdhills.
bluebirdhills@
> Laurel,
> This alpaca does have a lot of fleece on his cheeks, so that hides
> the jawline somewhat. But it's very noticeable, probably 15º off,
> maybe 20. At first glance, you can clearly see the muzzle is not
> correct.
>
> So, since a wry mouth is ignored by senior judges at halter shows,
> how can we expect breeders to pull said animal from their programs?
>
> Surely the judges have a responsibility not to give awards to animals
> with obvious defects. If they give 1st place ribbons at level 5 shows
> to animals with those visible defects, how can anyone expect breeders
> to cull animals with suspected defects they can't see, in that animal?
>
>
> Heather
>
>
>
> On Jun 25, 2009, at 5:18 AM, Bluebird Hills Farm wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> Hi Heather,
>>
>> I don't know how he could place if he has a wry mouth. When being
>> shown, he must have everything lined up correctly, or I can assure
>> you, the judges I have worked with both as a steward, and as an
>> apprentice, would never place this male. Is it possible that he
>> just carries it to the side when he is relaxed?
>>
>> If the teeth meet the gum in front correctly, and if the face does
>> not show any signs of being wry, with a crooked jaw, or teeth that
>> scoot to one side or the other when the bite is shown, then there
>> is no way for the judge to dock them for a defect they can't
>> visualize.
>>
>> As you know, they have about half a minute to assess the alpaca
>> stem to stern, so if it isn't obvious when examining the alpaca's
>> head and bite, then it may get overlooked, if it is mild or not
>> obvious at all.
>>
>> If it is obvious, then there is an issue and one would need to
>> bring attention to the problem in whatever way the complaintant
>> feels comfortable.
>>
>> Laurel
>>
>> The Shouvlins
>> Bluebird Hills Farm
>> Springfield, Ohio
>> 937-206-3936
>> www.bluebirdhills.
>> bluebirdhills@
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posted by Chaddo at 11:40 AM
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