Re: [AlpacaTalk] AOBA misconduct
I'm glad we agree that questions should be asked. It is our right as members. However, I don't think I should have to approach the board separately. I think it is THEIR job to communicate fully to the entire membership in an open forum. I have not seen that happen except in retrospect and when all was a "done deal," so to speak. Right now, there are many questions and no answers and nothing coming forth. As I said, silence speaks volumes. And with that, I will sit back and wait a bit more for a public response to the questions that have been raised. Back into my dark corner I go, waiting for a reasonable and timely communication.
Mary E. Meacher
Walnut Valley Alpacas
96 Ashdown Road
Ballston Lake, New York
Cell: 518.878.1061
Home: 518.399.5159
----- Original Message ----
From: "libby@alpacafarm.com" <libby@alpacafarm.com>
To: AlpacaTalk@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 9, 2008 7:53:23 PM
Subject: Re: [AlpacaTalk] AOBA misconduct
Hello Mary,
Did you mean Libby? I'll assume so.
I am not saying that questions can't and shouldn't be asked and I'm not
saying that you shouldn't ask them. What I'm saying to Heather is that
before she accuses people of all kinds of misconduct on lots of different
topics, (you've no doubt read some of them), she should do exactly what you
are doing and that is waiting to find out the answers before judging. She
isn't just talking about the subsidiary, she's accusing people of all kinds
of things. I have no questions with members asking AOBA questions... they
should. I have a problem with accusations of wrongdoing without proof.
Please contact Steve or Amy and ask them your questions. There are many
members who are satisfied and it's important to hear if you are not so that
you can get your questions answered. It sounds to me like they are still
consulting with lawyers and attorneys and may not know all the answers
yet...but I could be wrong about that so take that comment with a grain of
salt. I don't take it as an attack. It didn't feel like one.
I too have worked at non-for-profits with such profit centers so perhaps
that is why I don't feel the discomfort.
Take care and please ask a Board member your questions. I know that Amy
and Steve have both said they are happy to discuss this.
Libby
Libby Forstner
Magical Farms
mary meacher
<memeacher@yahoo.
com> To
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AlpacaTalk@yahoog cc
roups.com
Subject
Re: [AlpacaTalk] AOBA misconduct
01/09/2008 07:19
PM
Please respond to
AlpacaTalk@yahoog
roups.com
Abby,
You and I have agreed on many ocassions, however, in this instance I have
to say I have some issues with this entire turn of events. I have, in the
past supported AOBA, even during some unpopular times, but this latest
issue has made me sit back and reassess the organization. Perhaps it would
be a good disclaimer here to say that I have been an employee of at least
two very large non-profit organizations and I have never, in the past seen
this kind of arrangement for this type of reasoning. I am quite mystifyed.
I will grant you, Heather's vitruprative attack and accusastions were
somewhat unwarranted, however, in many of her statements there were some
kernels of truth that have me, and many other unspoken members nodding our
collective heads. I am waiting for the board to give a FULL public
disclosure of the events that have taken place along with a much better
communication of those events and the future for AOBA members than a short
letter. No substantial questions have been publicly answered or addressed
and I am quite dismayed by that. The silence from the board quite recently
has, in its own way, spoken volumes. On the other hand, your unyielding
trust and staunch loyalty without answers to some very telling questions
from the board, does not leave a warm and gooey feeling for me.
We have always regarded each other with respect and honesty in the past, I
hope you can understand that this posting should not at all be construed
as an attack on you, or in support of Heather. However, I do feel the Board
has some communication with the membership that needs to be done publicly
and forthrightly.
The turning toward happiness as a valid goal and the conscious decision to
seek happiness in a systematic manner can profoundly change the rest of our
lives. — Dalai LamaMary E. Meacher
Walnut Valley Alpacas
96 Ashdown Road
Ballston Lake, New York
Cell: 518.878.1061
Home: 518.399.5159
----- Original Message ----
From: "libby@alpacafarm. com" <libby@alpacafarm. com>
To: AlpacaTalk@yahoogro ups.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 9, 2008 2:42:31 PM
Subject: Re: [AlpacaTalk] AOBA misconduct
Hello Heather,
I hope you see. I've spent a lot of time explaining myself. That would be
a bummer, wouldn't it?
Okay, Heather then...show us the proof that it is illegal. This is very
important information to share with the Board. So, what is the
proof??????? If you know that AOBA is making a mistake, shouldn't you share
your proof?
Ah...another lie, Heather. And anther exciting innuendo of wrong doing re:
building. Let's set the record straight. I have never refused to answer
any question about the building AOBA is leasing but I'd LOVE to discuss
this topic. So...Heather. ...who owns the building AOBA leases? By the way,
what is the lease amount and how much is the lease costing AOBA's
membership? How much is the shared space costing AOBA? Sounds devious and
we should certainly get ot the bottom of this one as well!!
Yes, I agree....Amy said that not telling the FULL membership first was a
mistake (although it was mentioned at the conference as well as at the
Affiliate meeting and in the Minutes so they were hardly hiding it and so
your accusations of hiding were fabrications. ) Everyone makes mistakes
Heather... However, Amy apologized.. .what else do you want...blood?
Obviously... .
Yes, benefactors are sponsors. No, as I've said before, they are not
charitable donations so your insistance before that AOBA was required to
give out some charitable contribution receipt wasn't accurate but I can
understand your confusion on this. Sorry you don't want to understand the
concept. These benefactors do give a lot of money for a sponsorship that
clearly isn't worth the cost and so it is a "fund raiser" for AOBA;
however, for IRS purposes, it is an expense...a sponsorship.
I have an idea re: $34.673....How about finding out what the money is for
and who is getting it before stating that something is being done wrong?
You know....find out exactly what it is for and who is it for before
attacking and accusing people of wrongdoing? Why must you see a number and
simply "assume" that something is wrong? Why not check it out first before
going public and guessing that something is wrong? THIS is what I'm trying
to get across to you.
I was actually done talking but since you've come up with some new exciting
accusations, I wouldn't want someone to think I'm afraid to answer them.
Awaiting your answers..... .......
Libby
Libby Forstner
Magical Farms
Heather Zeleny
<alpacatalk@ westw
indalpacas.com> To
Sent by: AlpacaTalk@yahoogro ups.com
AlpacaTalk@yahoog cc
roups.com
Subject
[AlpacaTalk] AOBA misconduct
01/09/2008 10:52
AM
Please respond to
AlpacaTalk@yahoog
roups.com
Libby,
I see what you're doing.
Yes, I do have proof that this most likely illegal ALC has been
created. At the time of writing, I had not gone to the AOBA member site
to look it up myself. I was posting in response to a post from a
concerned alpaca breeder. Happy now? No, this was not some made up
fairy story, this is a very suspect action taken by the AOBA BOD. It
wrong and anyone with any common sense can see that.
Not disclosing and announcing their plans to create this company well
in advance, and putting up to membership vote, is WRONG!!!!!!! !
Probably some law breaking going on.
Benefactors to AOBA. Bullshit. They are not making charitable
contributions, you've admitted that yourself. This is advertising
expense that is out of reach for many if not most breeders.
Alpacas Magazine ad sales commissions: Who gets them? I don't know, but
that expense is on the P&L clear as day. SOMEONE is paid that
$34,673.97 (as of June 30, 2007)!!!! That's only for the YTD ending the
2nd quarter.
Here's another question you refuse to acknowledge: Who owns the
building that AOBA leases for their headquarters?
I have more and will post more information and questions as I find
them. Yes, this is taking a lot of investigating, and information is
rolling in from many sources, daily. Yes, if you want discussion about
what really is going on, this is the discussion group for you!
Best regards,
Heather
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posted by Chaddo at 5:27 PM
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