Re: [AlpacaTalk] Re: LGD with alpaca
Chrystella, there are a couple of things you might consider. First of all, I agree with Heather that your dog needs a companion (have you ever seen someone who was responsible for things 24/7? They go nuts because they have no one else to rely on, so they can't sleep, can't rest. . . etc.) There are good dogs available for very little cost through rescues who might be what you need.
Secondly, Maremma do need some guidance (whether you call it "training" or not) so they know what you want them to guard against. Yes, Maremma need to bond with you as the alpha dog, but their priority should be the herd they are expected to guard. I have a pair of Maremma sisters who will soon be split up so that one gal will guard my males and one my females (as soon as I convince the females that a dog is okay!). Like you, I'm relatively new to LGDs but have learned lots from a couple of Yahoo Maremma groups. I also was concerned about having the dogs bond to me instead of the herd; I was concerned that one of the dogs was very "puppyish" in her behavior toward the alpacas (barking and chasing and nipping at boys who were fighting). However, the more mature sister has pretty much "trained" the less mature gal to be more circumspect, and has also taken on the "lead dog" position when faced with potential threats (of course, the "threats"
are usually passing cars/trucks, but also -- fortunately -- include midnight visitors at the cemetery across the street; God only know what they're up to!) Nevertheless, I've had to ensure that the girls understand that not only are my alpacas to be guarded, but that my geese, guineas, chickens, cats and I are all their protectorates! It takes some time and patience, and Maremmas - probably like any LGD -- are very intelligent and DO tend to think for themselves. If they hear you yell at someone (as I tend to do my guinea because he's so aggressive against the other poultry), you're taught them that that individual/species is "the enemy" and you need to help them understand that individually the aggressor is okay, but that specific behavior is unacceptable.
I've found my LGDs to be VERY conscientious about propriety. Neither of them would dream of walking out of the barn/pasture area they've been confined to without my ispecific nvitation. When a couple of alpaca males broke down a section of fencing last fall, the boys all went "walkabout" but the dogs wouldn't leave the pasture! They know who belongs where, and get very upset if someone intrudes where he/she doesn't belong, but also if someone is taken from their normal space. It makes for interesting times when you're doing breedings, or have a farm visitor, or the vet stops in to do procedures, but that's part of what we as owners need to be aware of and prepared for.
I urge you to join one of more of the LGD groups and ask questions and explain circumstances. Particularly the working maremma group understands what it means to have on duty LGDs, but the regular maremma group is very knowledgeable, although more breeding or pet-oriented.
'
Judith Korff
LadySong Suris and Sebastapols
Harmonizing Quali .ty, Value, and Service
Randolph, New York 14772
Cell: (716) 499-0383
www.alpacanation.
____________
From: chrystella.volk <chrystella.volk@
To: AlpacaTalk@yahoogro
Sent: Friday, March 20, 2009 4:29:51 PM
Subject: [AlpacaTalk] Re: LGD with alpaca
Heather - I am not being critical of your advise. The former owners basicly blame me for all of the short comings of this pup. He was not even made familiar with a leash. He doesn't understand 'come'. I am frustrated beyond belief.
I originally was planning on getting an older dog even if it cost me more. I was told by them that it would not be a good idea to bring in an older LGD because there would be something wrong with it or they would not be getting rid of it. I thought that with a lot of farms downsizing or exiting the business due to the economy, it would be a great way to provide a mature dog with a herd, especially since they would already be familiar with the job.
I just don't know what to do. My area is said to have a coyote problem and I have a cria due in May. I have to figure this out quickly.
And seriously thank you for offering your advise, that was one of the reasons I joined this site.
--- In AlpacaTalk@yahoogro ups.com, Heather Zeleny <alpacatalk@ ...> wrote:
>
> My apologies that "train" isn't the right term for use with LGDs, I
> don't know another term. That's what they use on LGD sites. Any dog
> will need obedience training. It does need to bond with you and to
> recognise you as pack leader. Otherwise it has no reason to care
> about following your commands.
>
> You say you don't need more than one LGD. One dog cannot do much
> against predators like coyotes or packs of roaming neighborhood dogs.
> If you're guarding against humans, maybe a different breed, but not
> allowed inside pastures would be better for your situation.
>
> I did not recommend another dog just to be a playmate with your dog.
> Fact is, one dog WILL be very lonely, and one dog will not be able to
> fully protect against threats. A few years ago, a breeder in the
> midwest lost their entire herd to a pack of pet dogs despite having
> multiple LGDs on duty.
>
> I am by no means an expert on LGDs. We had one, and he was not a
> happy single dog. He liked the alpacas well enough, and did a good
> job keeping raccoons and deer out of pastures. Luckily we never had
> coyotes or roaming dogs come into pastures.
>
> I hope that those who have more experience with LGDs will respond. In
> the meantime, I do recommend finding LGD discussion groups for more
> info.
>
> Best of luck!
> Heather
>
>
> On Mar 20, 2009, at 11:32 AM, chrystella.volk wrote:
>
> > I appreciate the advise, but I can not justify investing in another
> > LGD so that this one can have a playmate. I do not need 2 dogs. If
> > that is the case, I may as well return him for a refund.
> >
> > I am also confused with your commenting about training. The former
> > owner expressly told me when I contacted them about returning the
> > dog that the term train is not a proper term to use in regards with
> > an LGD. I have also read that obedience training increases the
> > human to dog bonding and that it should not be encouraged.
> >
> > Chrys
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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posted by Chaddo at 5:39 PM
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