Re: [Alpacasite] Re: Farm and Ranch Guide decisions

Rick,

Can I personally request that you ban sharon kennels for this obvious
flame. You have been very diligent in banning those that will not follow
the rules and this post is an obvious example of someone not following
the rules.

Sharon - I welcome your post and I would normally defend your right to
make it but we have rules and those that break them get banned from the
list.

It was great having you but I suspect if Rick follows his guidelines
then we are not likely to be hearing from you in the future.

Tim Wilson
Sterling Forrest Alpacas
Chagrin Falls, OH

sharonkennels wrote:

>Steve get real. Who died and made you God?
>How do you read the minds of the people who order the farm and ranch
>guide? Are you Jesus Crist come back early?
>So the farm and ranch guide cost umpteen dollars to produce, so
>what, is it your money? No it is the money that we members pay.
>
>If the people who pay for leads find out that the leads have no
>acreage, maybe they should see my success. I did not pay for a lead
>but had someone with no acreage get a F And R guide which they would
>not have bought, then phoned me to ask about alpacas and I sold them
>acreage at a 150 percent profit.
>All from my farm and ranch guide ad.
>
>I suggest you members of the marketing comittee wake up and look at
>the real world.
>Raise the price of the ads. Charge people more for the web site
>listing. Cut out the tv ads which by the way point people to
>www.alpacainfo.com where they will now be asked to pay for sending
>out our advertising.
>Why should we give a worthless plan like ripping off potential
>customers for year.
>
>Get real people. We farmers who elected you are not going to drop
>out. We are going to go the courts and kick you out.
>
>Sharon Kennels.
>I am anonymous so as not to get banned.
>But your gestapo leader will ban me anyway.
>Goodbye
>
>
>
>--- In Alpacasite@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Hull, TimberLake Farms.
>Inc" <steve@t...> wrote:
>
>
>>Kim, I hear your concern on the Farm and Ranch Guide (F&RG)
>>
>>
>mailing
>
>
>>fee, but consider that about 30% (or more) or the F&RGs have been
>>sent out to people with absolutely no intention of raising
>>alpacas. That guide costs a lot of money both for printing and
>>mailing (I think $30-40 or so). Prior to now, there has been no
>>
>>
>fee
>
>
>>for the guide nor a fee for the mailing cost.
>>
>>Secondly, a lot of people who get (and pay for) the leads complain
>>that the many (majority?) of the leads are people with no acreage
>>
>>
>or
>
>
>>no intention of raising alpacas. The people who purchase the
>>
>>
>leads
>
>
>>from AOBA ask us to "qualify" the leads better. We thought we
>>
>>
>were
>
>
>>doing this by asking about the size of the farm, but frankly
>>
>>
>people
>
>
>>"say" they have 100 acres when they only have a 1/4 acre lot.
>>
>>Can we really afford to send out this cost of a publication with
>>
>>
>no
>
>
>>qualifications whatsoever? The Marketing Committee spend many
>>
>>
>nights
>
>
>>and many long discussions on exactly this issue. They recommended
>>
>>
>to
>
>
>>the board, and the board agreed that we would send out the guide
>>free, but attach a small mailing fee ($9.95).
>>
>>If they do not want to spend that small sum, we are still
>>
>>
>collecting
>
>
>>names, addresses so that we can send out other lower cost material.
>>
>>Yes, we expect that the total numbers of F&RGs sent out will go
>>
>>
>down,
>
>
>>but we expect that the numbers of qualified leads will increase
>>tremendously. Let's give it try this way for a year and then we
>>
>>
>do
>
>
>>plan to re-evaluate.
>>
>>Erin McCarthy may have additional comments as she spend many, many
>>nights discussing this with the marketing committee.
>>
>>Steve H.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>At 03:18 PM 12/08/2005, you wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Hi Janet,
>>>I also ask people that visit my farm how they found me. After
>>>reviewing the new membership levels before renewing this year, I
>>>contacted past clients and visitors that said they had found me in
>>>the F&R Guide to inquire what they thought about a fee associated
>>>with receiving the information packet. The ones that had sent for
>>>the AOBA packet said they would NOT have paid to receive it.
>>>I think the F&R Guide has been a valuable marketing tool for me in
>>>the past when there was not a charge to interested parties, and I
>>>
>>>
>do
>
>
>>>understand that things need to change financially for AOBA with
>>>regard to the free mailing. I believe mailings will significantly
>>>decrease as people won't want to pay to receive advertising, as
>>>
>>>
>you
>
>
>>>point out, and more prospective new breeders will find web sites
>>>useful as their source for locating existing farms. Not sure what
>>>changes we will see for 2007 renewals, but it would be reasonable
>>>
>>>
>to
>
>
>>>deduct that if the Guide is mailed at no cost again, the cost to
>>>advertise in it will go up. Should be interesting to hear what
>>>people think after this year and to see how the numbers of
>>>advertisers and Guides mailed out changed.
>>>Kim
>>>Columbine Ranch, Morrison, CO
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>--- In Alpacasite@yahoogroups.com, "Dream Chaser Alpacas"
>>><hufford@d...> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>I know this has been discussed on the site previously, but I
>>>>
>>>>
>have
>
>
>>>>recently had a complaint from someone interested in alpacas
>>>>
>>>>
>about
>
>
>>>AOBA
>>>
>>>
>>>>requiring interested parties to "pay for AOBA's advertising".
>>>>
>>>>
>>>This
>>>
>>>
>>>>person has informed me that they would not ever pay to have
>>>>
>>>>
>>>someone
>>>
>>>
>>>>elses advertising sent to them....and the price of nearly $10
>>>>
>>>>
>to
>
>
>>>>receive the advertising material is outrageous. One farm
>>>>
>>>>
>visitor
>
>
>>>>stated there were only 5 farms listed in their area they would
>>>>
>>>>
>be
>
>
>>>>visiting and if they had had to pay for the guide, they
>>>>
>>>>
>wouldn't
>
>
>>>be
>>>
>>>
>>>>visiting them unless they had learned about them another way.
>>>>
>>>>
>As
>
>
>>>his
>>>
>>>
>>>>wife said, "I wouldn't pay 2 bucks a farm just for names!"
>>>>
>>>>This is of high concern to us as a small alpaca farm. Four of
>>>>
>>>>
>the
>
>
>>>six
>>>
>>>
>>>>contacts made by us with prospective buyers this past year was
>>>>
>>>>
>>>through
>>>
>>>
>>>>our ad in the guide (including one from Canada) and one was
>>>>
>>>>
>from
>
>
>>>the
>>>
>>>
>>>>online farm site listing. And although we are not actively
>>>>
>>>>
>>>pursuing
>>>
>>>
>>>>sales currently, we have tried to show our visitors that even a
>>>>
>>>>
>>>small
>>>
>>>
>>>>farm venture can succeed, as we have grown from 5 to 11
>>>>
>>>>
>alpacas in
>
>
>>>>just over a year, built our outbuildings, and begun agisting
>>>>
>>>>
>>>animals.
>>>
>>>
>>>>We try to help them understand what is entailed and what they
>>>>
>>>>
>can
>
>
>>>>realistically expect. Then we refer them to farms we believe
>>>>are "reliable" to purchase animals or research further, and we
>>>>
>>>>
>>>refer
>>>
>>>
>>>>them to a couple of alpaca sites to learn the "good, bad, and
>>>>
>>>>
>the
>
>
>>>>ugly".
>>>>
>>>>Most of our visitors are not looking for a get rich scheme,
>>>>
>>>>
>they
>
>
>>>are
>>>
>>>
>>>>researching a possible change in lifestyle for their families
>>>>
>>>>
>and
>
>
>>>a
>>>
>>>
>>>>future income - which will at least allow them to live
>>>>
>>>>
>comfortably
>
>
>>>and
>>>
>>>
>>>>as some have said, spend more time with their families.
>>>>
>>>>Since the anouncement of the changes in policy, we have also
>>>>
>>>>
>asked
>
>
>>>our
>>>
>>>
>>>>visitors if they received the guide or just accessed us on
>>>>
>>>>
>line,
>
>
>>>and
>>>
>>>
>>>>if they would have paid for it if necessary. ALL have said they
>>>>
>>>>
>>>would
>>>
>>>
>>>>not have paid for the guide. At least two have bought into
>>>>
>>>>
>>>alpacas,
>>>
>>>
>>>>one a dispersal herd. The others are continuing their research,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>three
>>>
>>>
>>>>of them are on this site. This is at least four people who
>>>>
>>>>
>might
>
>
>>>not
>>>
>>>
>>>>have found our farm if they had to pay for the guide.
>>>>
>>>>Since our ad in the guide is paid for by us with the intention
>>>>
>>>>
>and
>
>
>>>>understanding that our listing be made available to possible
>>>>
>>>>
>>>future
>>>
>>>
>>>>buyers and those researching alpacas as a business, we have
>>>>
>>>>
>become
>
>
>>>>even more concerned with AOBA charging $9.95 for the guide
>>>>
>>>>
>under
>
>
>>>the
>>>
>>>
>>>>ruse of shipping. I ship packages to Alaska, and sometimes
>>>>
>>>>
>that
>
>
>>>>doesn't even cost me $9.95.
>>>>
>>>>Does anyone else share these concerns? If what our farm
>>>>
>>>>
>visitors
>
>
>>>have
>>>
>>>
>>>>said are true, I don't see a reason to use the farm guide as
>>>>
>>>>
>part
>
>
>>>of
>>>
>>>
>>>>our advertising plan.
>>>>
>>>>Janet Hufford
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Opinions and postings on this list are the sole responsibility of
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>>>
>>>
>Yahoo.
>
>
>>>
>>>List administrator - Rick Horn - All American Alpacas alpacas@a...
>>>http://aaalpacas.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>>
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>
>
>>>Yahoo! Groups Links
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>Steve . . . .
>>
>> TimberLake Farms, Inc.
>> Tom Cameron, D.V.M. & Steve Hull, Ph.D.
>> Edmond, Oklahoma
>>
>>A Full Service Alpaca Farm Including Seminars And Consulting
>>
>> www.timberlakefarms.net
>>
>>e-mails: mailto:steve@t...
>> mailto:tom@t...
>>
>> Farm Telephone: 405 341-8444
>> Farm Cell Telephone: 405 550-3023
>> Farm Fax: 405 330-8444
>>
>>note: opinions made here are not and cannot be construed to be
>>specific veterinary advice, diagnosis or treatments. Both Tom and
>>Steve strongly suggest always checking with your own veterinarian.
>>
>>
>>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Opinions and postings on this list are the sole responsibility of the person posting the message. The accuracy and content of each message in no way reflect the opinions of the administrator or Yahoo.
>
>
>
>List administrator - Rick Horn - All American Alpacas alpacas@alpacaweb.com
>http://aaalpacas.com
>
>
>
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>
>
>
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>
>
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>
>

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